01:24:08 back 01:24:24 phone 01:37:48 ok - I'm mostly back as well 01:38:47 incoming 900 number? 01:38:52 I wish 01:38:59 me to 01:39:17 a friend trying to get Windows XP to run for more than 14 seconds without getting a virus ;) 01:39:32 Were you thinking of writing the ini conversion program using c++ 01:39:43 C or C++ probably 01:39:44 keep xp off line 01:40:01 actually, the problem started before he plugged in the network cable 01:40:04 So a line by line conversion 01:40:09 maybe it was a floppy or CD 01:40:17 sort of 01:40:25 ah. itunes, sony, or ms 01:40:31 I was thinking more that there should be a configuration file for the translator 01:40:49 a rule set. 01:40:55 yep 01:41:16 with snippets of hal and/or ini code that get pasted into the output file(s) wen certain things are found in the input ini file 01:41:18 something like the file you built for kbuild demo 01:41:37 hmmm - I'm not sure about that 01:42:12 Paul is working toward xml for config stuff. 01:42:17 really? 01:42:24 I thought he was opposed to that??? 01:42:31 yup on the BDI fork 01:42:40 cool. we should sync up 01:42:48 Was till he built a demo for a LUG meet. 01:43:00 heh - probably was 100x easier to configure 01:43:07 * rayh looks for the parser he used. 01:43:18 I think it was libxml or something 01:45:23 I really like the KDE-style config management scheme 01:45:36 too bad the standalone library is unmaintained 01:48:36 xpat 01:48:49 expat? 01:49:08 short memory, switches with my kvm 01:49:09 good question 01:49:13 hweh 01:49:15 heh 01:49:42 yep expat is it. 01:50:05 yep 01:50:46 He also favors using autotools nowadays. 01:51:03 that's the step above ./configure? 01:51:23 He calls it's advantage building "selective systems." 01:51:49 yep - better tuned configs for the specific build environment 01:52:10 I tried to talk us into selective builds for EMC 01:52:31 yep - that's one of hte things the KBuild stuff was aimed at 01:52:53 "don't build ppmc, because it doesn't compile, and I don't need it anyway" 01:53:09 buthey... 01:53:13 heh 01:53:24 nothingevergoesasplanned 01:53:34 the configure stuff is a big step forward. 01:53:42 yep 01:54:13 it's amazing how you have to think "don't tick the spacebar, thumb." 01:54:23 heh 01:54:59 eventually (maybe in the 2.4 or 2.6 timeframe), we may be able to make a new emcHALsh, plus an extended VCP-like thing, and get the last "feature" of mach off our bnacks - configurable screens 01:55:08 backsd 01:55:10 backs 01:55:56 then there is vtcl with an EMC enabled lib 01:56:08 emc or emc2? 01:56:20 I think that's what I meant with emcHALsh 01:56:31 I made it originally for emc but it would work equally well with 2 01:56:49 ie, emcsh + HAL in tcl-usable form, with UI controls that are placed from a config file 01:58:20 One has to be careful about direct applications to hal. 01:58:33 how so? 01:58:35 witness the recent "weaving" discussion. 01:59:03 sure, but I see that not as a HAL problem, but that emc isn't meant for what he wants 01:59:08 many times better control through gcode 01:59:38 true, and the subroutine support makes the problem mostly moot 02:00:25 Yep. But because HAL is so damned accessable many view it as the first line of customization. 02:00:35 true 02:01:12 there is a slight breakdown between the "device driver" aspects and actual control software 02:01:16 btw if you put the weave generator between pid and motmod it works 02:01:40 only if you allow the max weave offset as ferror 02:02:00 no because ferror is computed from pid input 02:02:02 doesn't motion calculate its own ferror? 02:02:12 not that I see. 02:02:19 odd. I thought it did 02:03:25 You are without a doubt much closer to truth there than I am. 02:03:40 of course - I'm just telling you what I think ;) 02:03:56 I may be totally wrong about pid/motion though 02:54:32 rayh has quit 06:23:20 SWPadnos_ has quit 10:50:59 morning all 11:00:22 anonimasu has joined #emc-devel 11:19:14 hey anders 11:21:29 hey 11:21:31 it's been a while 11:23:56 yeah.. didn't see you much lately 11:25:19 busy with life & work 11:25:25 mostly with life 11:28:30 nice 11:31:45 yeah 11:31:51 how are you doing? 11:35:43 I am rewriting this software again 11:44:40 hmm.. pretty ok 11:44:43 kinda busy 11:45:15 nice :) 13:02:56 good morning 13:03:02 alex_joni: on my new machine I get bug 1205237 13:03:08 (mode not switching) 13:04:09 from the bug report it looks like you know the most about it; do you have any idea what we should do next to figure it out? 13:04:27 btw make install/make deb work now 13:07:36 also jepler got the same behavior on his laptop 13:10:52 rayh has joined #emc-devel 13:19:45 seen the make install stuff, nice 13:20:08 ok, now regarding to that bug, I didn't touch it in a while, and I don't have a machine now that does it 13:23:21 that bug? 13:23:55 Hi Alex. 13:25:35 15:05 < cradek> alex_joni: on my new machine I get bug 1205237 13:25:35 15:05 < cradek> (mode not switching) 13:25:35 15:06 < cradek> from the bug report it looks like you know the most about it; 13:25:35 do you have any idea what we should do next to figure it out? 13:25:35 15:06 < cradek> btw make install/make deb work now 13:25:38 15:09 < cradek> also jepler got the same behavior on his laptop 13:25:40 15:13 -!- rayh [n=swanlake@dial-pn1-17.wic.up.net] has joined #emc-devel 13:26:24 cradek: how fast is your debugging process on that machine? Is that your home machine? 13:26:38 thanks 13:26:50 cradek: how often does the bug appear? (only after a lot of mode-switches, or just after a few?) 13:27:17 cradek: last time I've seen that ( a few months ago iirc), I had to change modes like crazy (about 50-60 times till it locked) 13:29:37 * alex_joni is reading the bug notes to refresh his memory 13:49:13 alex_joni: yes it's my home machine, and it shows up immediately/always 13:49:24 I can switch modes 1-2 times and then it always hangs 13:50:22 ok, that's GOOD 13:50:42 I think it's some racing condition, that ends up in having those bits set wrong 13:52:08 that sounds like it won't be very fun to hunt down 14:13:02 What gui is the bug 1205237 reported on? 14:13:30 all 14:13:35 it's not a gui bug 14:13:57 EMC2? 14:13:59 yes 14:14:19 the problem is I've changed two things at once: I got a much faster computer and I switched to rtai 14:14:21 I've switched a couple thousand times here in the last 10 minutes and don't see anything with tkemc 14:14:28 so either of those might have been the cause 14:14:59 it happens for me with either gui after just a couple switches 14:15:14 it's a totally fatal bug 14:15:27 jepler gets the same thing on his (fast) laptop 14:15:54 Okay. This is bdi-4.30 with the 2.95.4 compiler 14:16:10 do you know which rtai version that is? 14:16:17 magma 14:18:25 my current guess is it's related somehow to machine speed 14:18:36 it might be hard to find. 15:03:28 oops.. sorry 15:03:37 was away for a while welding some pipes, back now 15:04:21 cradek: it is related to machine speed, but so far I've only seen it on very slow machines 15:04:25 on a PII-233 15:06:27 I think our machines are around 2GHz... also maybe it's worse with rtai3.3 15:07:05 don't think so 15:07:12 you at the machine now? 15:07:15 or only at home? 15:07:51 the machines I tried are 1.4GHz (one Athlon, one Centrino), but also a 2.66GHz P4 15:23:27 and never seen it there 15:23:28 :D 15:33:37 * alex_joni heads home.. 15:34:39 the machine is at home but I have ssh to it 15:35:00 maybe we should compare latencies instead of processor speed 15:35:37 like I said, maybe rtai3.3 is faster/slower and therefore makes the problem worse 16:09:52 I think we can nail the problem 16:10:08 for any speeds/latencies 16:12:10 it's a flag set when it shouldn't 16:12:14 or a check too early 16:12:33 maybe the mode switch shouldn't get done while not INPOS set 16:13:50 I see some strange things at first glance... 16:15:21 but I need to study the stuff in control.c a bit more thoroughly 16:15:26 but, dinner first ;) 16:15:56 actually late lunch :D 16:48:45 Hi guys 16:48:50 hey cradek - what's the best place to put in AXIS feature requests? 16:57:04 email, or here 16:57:16 ok. 16:57:16 we don't have a feature request tracker except the wishlist (TODO) in cvs 16:57:34 ok - I considered a SF tracker item in the axis category 16:58:13 I considered that, but it's overkill 16:58:20 ok 16:58:23 have a look at the TODO in cvs 16:58:32 axis CVS? 16:58:36 yeah 16:58:53 I looked at the list of possible additions for 1.2 (I think) 16:59:32 so all this aside, what's the request? 16:59:36 heh 16:59:41 several, actually 17:00:02 I finally fired it up on the 800x600 touchscreen (though I wasn't using the touch driver) 17:00:11 first, a full-screen mode would be great 17:00:32 that's a function of your window manager. 17:00:42 second, the tooltip text is unreadable because it's so small (about 5 pixels high) 17:00:53 that's an X misconfiguration. 17:00:57 true - or you could make it draw on the root window 17:00:59 hey these are easy 17:01:01 heh 17:01:05 pass the buck 17:01:07 no, that would be an abomination. 17:01:32 the problem is that X can't read your monitor's DDC information, so it calculates a wrong DPI. 17:01:40 set your monitor's size in xorg.conf 17:01:47 also, add several controls that allow you to change the left-drag function on the preview - zoom, pan, and rotate 17:01:52 I think it's set, but I can check 17:02:27 basically that last one makes it so you can still use all the preview features with only one button and dragging 17:02:36 Section "Monitor" 17:02:37 ... 17:02:45 DisplaySize 123 456 17:02:47 EndSection 17:02:59 replace with your display's size in mm 17:03:01 what font size is that supposed to be? 17:03:19 umm... small 17:03:28 let me see if I can find it 17:03:39 heh - it is certainly small 17:09:55 SWPadnos: run xdpyinfo and check for these two lines 17:09:56 dimensions: 1600x1200 pixels (411x311 millimeters) 17:09:56 resolution: 99x98 dots per inch 17:11:42 actually, the size was set wrong 17:11:50 does that fix it? 17:12:09 not sure yet - I'm creating a desktop shortcut :) 17:12:17 to save time, dontcha know 17:12:19 btw, in icewm (and also gnome I think) you can make a window fullscreen with Alt-F11 17:12:33 I see that KDE has a fullscreen option as well 17:12:49 we should make a good icon for emc 17:13:20 * alex_joni plans to do that 17:13:28 what size is an icon usually? 17:13:35 32x32 or bigger? 17:13:39 I remember someone drew chips2 and he was pretty good 17:13:43 do you remember who that was? 17:13:47 I expect 256 colors, or 24bit 17:13:56 chips2? 17:14:36 yeah he was like chips but drawn better 17:14:49 he was holding an end mill in one ... flipper 17:15:00 huh, that might have been me 17:15:08 hang on, I'll give you an URL soon 17:15:12 fenn did one 17:15:35 he was wearing safety goggles 17:16:04 oh, then probably it was fenn's 17:16:28 cradek: what size icon? 17:16:41 I don't remember what it was 17:16:45 how about svg, targeting 48x48 17:16:51 I think it was a medium-sized image, not an icon 17:17:00 no, I mean what size should the icon have? 17:17:04 fenn had made a desktop / bootup background, I think 17:17:14 48x48 is the standard, I think 17:17:26 I only made an chips2 ages ago, but I don't like how it looks.. 17:17:26 at least it was for NextStep ;) 17:17:29 http://www.robcon.ro/emc/chips2.jpg 17:18:01 maybe a chisel with a motor on it 17:18:45 http://fenn.dyndns.org/pub/emc/chips2.png 17:19:21 I think that's the one I remember 17:20:12 I'm not sure I love either of the chips2, but this is the kind of thing I stay out of because I have no artistic skills. 17:20:25 my problem as well 17:20:38 is your font problem fixed? 17:20:38 my wife is a graphic designer though, so we may be able to get something done 17:20:45 they're readable now - thanks 17:20:50 still a bit small 17:21:16 they're supposed to be small but legible 17:21:38 I can't even find where the font is set 17:21:53 in KDE, there's a fullscreen mode, but if the application doesn't provide a way of getting out of it, then you have to use the keyboard to get through the application menus to restore to non-FS mode 17:22:07 it's legible if I'm within 2" of the screen 17:22:20 SWPadnos: what DPI does X think it is now? 17:22:26 one sec 17:22:54 81x81 dpi 17:23:09 alightly over 1 pixel/point 17:23:12 slightly 17:25:11 how's this? http://www.robcon.ro/emc/chips2icon.png 17:25:28 not bad, actually :) 17:25:40 I agree 17:25:48 ok, that was a quickie ;) 17:25:58 it can get better if I do it slower :) 17:26:04 but I need to rush out now 17:26:07 * alex_joni will be back later 17:26:11 bye 17:26:13 see ya 17:26:20 cradek: if you can use it, be my guest 17:26:37 we need to package it along with emc2 17:26:54 so users will get the icon on the desktop after apt-get'ing 17:26:57 toss it in cvs and we'll figure out what make install should do with it 17:27:13 ok, along with the splash? 17:27:13 make a desktop link ro emc, probably ;) 17:27:17 s/ro/to/ 17:27:25 sure 17:27:45 we'll have to figure out how ubuntu handles putting things on the menu etc. 17:28:17 ok, will do that later ;) 17:28:51 yeah. 17:29:20 is the "live" distro going to be ubuntu now? 17:29:58 none of us can predict the future, but I'm working on some ubuntu stuff. 17:30:27 "this document contains forward-looking statements, which cannot be guaranteed ... " 17:30:46 THIS PAGE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK 17:30:55 this brain intentionally left blank 17:31:48 laters everyone.. I'm off 17:37:31 OK - so I guess the feature requests boil down to (1) possibly adding a button to toggle fullscreen mode (WM dependent, I suspect), and (2) adding drag mode selection for the preview window 17:38:26 oh - and if there's a context menu added to the G-code display, then have a button to toggle that as well (maybe click a line, then click a" menu" button) 18:13:22 can you explain what you mean by drag mode selection? 18:15:25 yes 18:15:46 right now, dragging with the middle button rotates 18:15:53 left button pans 18:16:03 no option for zoom (right?) 18:16:31 put buttons on the toolbar or somewhere so that a left drag can perform any of those functions 18:16:50 I think the right button or wheel zooms 18:16:59 shift does something too 18:17:27 how about keyboard modifiers? shift+drag, control+drag? 18:17:38 those would let you use just the left button, but still not muddy up the user interface 18:18:00 that would work 18:18:12 I see that shift+left = middle (rotate) 18:18:25 so add ctrl+left=zoom, and you're all set 18:20:28 * control + left drag = zoom, which is the final thing needed for left-button-only navigation (SWP's touchscreen). 18:20:48 (assuming I can even drag with it :) ) 18:20:58 but a touchpad would be the same 18:21:03 yeah, that part's up to you! 18:21:19 maybe I'll install the driver again 18:21:25 my touchpads all have three (two plus three-button emulation) buttons 18:21:48 true 18:22:18 for a very long time, X applications have always been able to assume three mouse buttons 18:22:42 yep - that's what we had on the Irises, way back when 18:22:58 with amazingly speedy 25 and 33MHz processors O_O 18:23:00 today we're near everyone assuming three buttons + wheel, but that's not the rule yet 18:23:22 what about those poor souls who are stuck with only a light pen? 18:23:40 I ran autocad on a sun 386i 18:23:48 not sure what the clock speed was, probably 25 18:24:02 oooh - the only 386 based computer that actually booted in 32-bit mode 18:24:25 nah 18:24:31 I ran OS/2 on a 386 too 18:24:57 I've still got a copy of Warp somewhere 18:25:04 but anyway, the point is we had three buttons 18:25:08 os2 rocked :) 18:25:11 I had v3 as well, on floppies 18:25:11 actually I had 16 18:25:13 yep 18:25:33 ok - a tablet with a 16-button puck 18:25:36 os2 only rocked when compared to windows 3.1 18:26:01 oh something's wrong? go wade through the 300 line config.sys 18:26:06 actually, it's still good compared to Windows 2000 or XP, but not necessarily in the eye candy department 18:26:14 yep 18:26:35 lots of banks still use it, because it doesn't crash 18:43:00 hello 18:45:46 welcome back 18:49:37 hi 18:57:36 whazzup? 19:13:58 not much 19:14:06 I'm at some friends ;) 19:31:29 hrmm.. do you guys have any idea why hdparm is failing? 19:31:52 hdparm -c3 -d1 /dev/hda 19:31:52 /dev/hda: 19:31:52 setting 32-bit IO_support flag to 3 19:31:52 setting using_dma to 1 (on) 19:31:54 HDIO_SET_DMA failed: Operation not permitted 19:31:57 IO_support = 3 (32-bit w/sync) 19:31:59 using_dma = 0 (off) 19:32:07 root? 19:32:42 yup 19:32:45 the 32bit works 19:32:54 only DMA can't get set 19:32:56 is this a BDI? 19:33:24 no, stock debian 19:33:28 hmmm 19:33:40 does hdparm work on scsi too? 19:33:51 not that I know of 19:33:54 no 19:34:03 ok.. but on IDE it should 19:34:59 maybe the specific chipset support wasn't compiled into the kernel? 19:35:34 -d Disable/enable the "using_dma" flag for this drive. This option 19:35:37 now works with most combinations of drives and PCI interfaces 19:35:40 which support DMA and which are known to the IDE driver. 19:35:50 that doesn't sound like a sure thing 19:35:52 http://seclists.org/lists/linux-kernel/2002/Oct/0162.html 19:39:13 SWPadnos: it's a stock debian SMP kernel 19:39:20 I'll check the config :( 19:39:46 yeah - it should have support for most of the common chipsets, but who knows 19:40:01 it's not SATA is it? 19:40:04 no, 19:40:08 udma4 19:40:15 hrmmm.. # CONFIG_IDEDISK_MULTI_MODE is not set 19:40:33 that's multiblock transfer, not DMA (I think) 19:40:55 CONFIG_IDEDMA_AUTO=y 19:41:51 I think that just sets DMA mode automatically, if the kernel knows it's usable 19:43:21 ok.. looking further 19:43:26 what's the chipset? 19:44:33 # cat /proc/ide/ide0/model 19:44:33 generic 19:44:48 I think it's not discovered properly 19:44:56 but I have no idea what chipset there is :D 19:45:18 dmesg | grep -i chipset ? 19:45:25 I'm not sure how they're reported, actually 19:45:54 Jan 20 17:12:58 localhost kernel: ICH: IDE controller at PCI slot 00:1f.1 19:45:54 Jan 20 17:12:58 localhost kernel: ICH: chipset revision 2 19:45:54 Jan 20 17:12:58 localhost kernel: ICH: not 100%% native mode: will probe irqs later 19:45:57 Jan 20 17:12:58 localhost kernel: ide0: BM-DMA at 0xfff0-0xfff7, BIOS settings: hda:DMA, hdb:pio 19:46:00 Jan 20 17:12:58 localhost kernel: ide1: BM-DMA at 0xfff8-0xffff, BIOS settings: hdc:DMA, hdd:pio 19:46:22 eeeww - an Intel 865 or similar 19:46:28 recent P4, right? 19:46:50 no, dual P3 XEON 19:46:58 older 19:47:04 ok - the ICH threw me 19:47:36 # dmesg | grep -i chipset 19:47:36 ICH: chipset revision 2 19:47:36 agpgart: Detected an Intel i840 Chipset. 19:47:45 ah - OK 19:47:54 any ideas? 19:48:34 http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0305.3/0055.html 19:49:02 I googled for i840 IDE DMA 19:52:58 ?? 19:53:15 that may not help though ;) 19:58:29 alex_joni: usually you just need the generic stuff there and it'll work.. 19:58:35 alex_joni: that was the case on my laptop.. 20:03:42 well.. it didn't 20:03:58 anyways, don't care right now, too tired :D 21:17:48 four hal variables in watch takes 956 microseconds per iteration 21:23:56 * alex_joni is back 21:24:25