00:00:22 OK - that didn't do it, so I did the rm -Rf src/ / cvs up -dP trick, which also didn't get the changes 00:01:32 are you using an anymous checkout ? 00:01:38 no 00:03:01 sure you have the right branch? 00:03:09 pretty sure - the CVS/* files show Tbdi-4 00:05:05 how fast is the sourceforge web CVS interface updates (or is it realtime)? 00:05:05 that shows 20 hours since the last commit on bdi-4 00:05:19 (or 7 or 8 hours on some stuff in src/) 00:05:56 the cvsweb page can be 24 hours or more behind 00:06:13 OK - that takes care of that 00:06:33 I assume you're updating the bdi-4 branch 00:08:23 cvs -q status src/Makefile 00:08:48 should report version: 1.1.6.4 00:09:04 well - I get 1.1.6.3 00:09:33 I probably need to use the "overwrite local changes with this update" flag when updating. 00:09:45 (whatever that is :) ) 00:10:20 aha - -C 00:11:37 latest toy: http://home.att.net/~jmkasunich/Pics/miniservo1.jpg 00:11:48 also miniservo2 and 3.jpg 00:13:11 where did you pick that up from? 00:13:11 dumpster - part of an Exabyte tape backup unit 00:15:06 damn 00:15:06 ray's right, it would make a nice little gantry 00:15:06 put a moving table under it 00:15:06 Z axis 00:15:06 how wide? 00:15:10 the longer axis travels about 11", the shorter one about 3.3" or so 00:15:45 bummer... looks like it was ~30" which would have been great 00:16:09 jmkasunich: Now, where was this dumpster at? =) 00:16:16 I did say "mini" servo ;-) 00:16:19 work 00:16:55 lat/lon ? 00:18:03 I'm in the process of planning out a cnc router, so any ideas parts are always a good thing =_ 00:18:08 =) 00:18:29 Hmmm.... I just deleted the entire emc2 tree, and re-CO'ed it, and the Makefile is still version 1.1.6.3 00:19:04 cleveland ohio - but it's not really a dumpster (as in outdoors), it's the loading dock where things are staged before they get hauled away (so not accessible from outside) 00:19:04 the big screw is about 6.7 turns per inch 00:19:11 (probably metric) 00:19:15 I'm in silicon valley, but no clue where to salvage things like that... just like your place 'indoors' 00:19:41 * Jymmm has ZERO problem dumpster diving for stuff like that. 00:19:53 Try to find out before March 5 - I'm heading to SF then, and I'd love to bring back a bunch of stuff :) 00:20:16 will do 00:20:21 than you 00:20:22 my problem is that I grab anything that looks good, until I can barely turn around in my basement 00:20:24 thank 00:20:38 who needs space anyway? 00:20:50 the problem is I couldn't even find cardboard boxes the last time I looked around town. sad huh? 00:21:09 I bet you can find coffee and Sushi though :) 00:21:51 shit.... there are Starbucks on opposite corners here. 00:21:51 yuppieville? 00:21:51 within 800' of each other 00:21:57 and they BOTH get heavy business 00:22:32 Yeah - that's a bummer. We have 4 in town now. 00:22:32 where are you SWP? 00:22:32 The local places still do pretty well, even with SB across the street 00:22:32 Burlington, VT (Essex junction, actually) 00:23:24 oh, for some reason I thought you were out west 00:23:24 what's it like up there right now? snowing? 00:23:24 I'm well west of Maine. The West Coast of New England, actually :) 00:23:35 not snowing now, but it only got up to 17 degrees today 00:23:40 brrrr 00:23:44 30 here 00:23:51 and snowing 00:23:56 yes. and my downstairs heater has been awaiting service for 2.5 months 00:24:09 sucks 00:24:15 sniff, sniff..... 00:24:15 (during the January from hell freezing over - never above 5 degrees) 00:24:20 * jmkasunich smells food 00:24:31 I'm still full from Brunch 00:24:36 time for dinner I think 00:24:39 (6 hours ago) 00:24:41 (I skipped lunch) 00:25:05 well it's 62 outside and I'm in shorts and a tshirt =) 00:25:09 dick 00:25:12 lol 00:25:25 did I mention barefoot too? 00:25:31 Pregnant? 00:25:43 sorry, no ice cream and pickles 00:25:56 Ah - I see. 00:26:26 Well - as I said - I'll be out in SF for Embedded Systems Conference in 2 weeks. I should get some reprieve then. 00:26:44 K`zan has joined #emc 00:27:20 hmmm... deleted src and did an update - Makefile is 1.1.6.4 00:27:34 im off cu next time folks 00:27:35 SWPLinux: Marconi Center? 00:27:44 Yes (Moscone) 00:27:52 oh yeah,,,, that 00:27:54 lol 00:27:57 roel1 has quit 00:28:01 I hate that place 00:28:15 Yes - especially as an exhibitor (which I'm not this time) 00:28:31 SWPadnos well, pick me up some samples 00:28:33 At least there's the House of Prime Rib. Yummmmm 00:29:53 K`zan has quit 00:34:05 hmm... metric... 4mm pitch on the big screw, 3:1 belt reduction 00:34:16 so 1.333 mm/rev of the motor 00:34:35 512CPR encoder 00:34:45 512? 00:34:56 yep 00:35:06 .0026mm resolution 00:35:09 kinda cool, unusual, but cool 00:35:20 not that uncommon 00:35:48 ~0.0001" - finer than I expected 00:35:50 1024 would have been my guess after 256 00:36:33 those bit converving bastards! 00:37:11 1024 is probably a little too fine for such a small diameter wheel 00:37:35 yeah 00:38:36 hmmm... small screw seems to be 0.250" pitch, I was expecting it to be metric too 00:38:50 oh mixed... yuck 00:39:09 Anyone have any links to deisgn concept for Z axis ? 00:39:10 they're just numbers ;-) 00:40:07 XY I get, just not Z 00:40:17 what do you mean? 00:41:15 Ok, as example.... if you mount a 8 lbs router on one side of the gantry, I would think the weight would sorta bind the motion. 00:42:04 I hope that makes sense. 00:42:04 if it's a concern, then run dual screws, one on each side. 00:42:44 you can drive them both with belts, and avoid the complexity of synchronizing multiple motors 00:43:09 dual screws sounds like overkill for a Z tho 00:43:20 just keep the screw as close as possible to the centerline of the router 00:43:39 true - I thought the question was about X or Y 00:43:53 and design the guide system (rails, whatever) to minimize tipping 00:43:57 no, no, I'm saying this wrong... I mean the wight of the router would prematurly wear whatever bearings there are (a la poor design) 00:44:31 right - the screw and router move as a single unit on a frame. 00:44:47 not the screw... the guides 00:44:57 You would need to use bearings that can handle 8 pounds. 00:44:57 the bearings need to be designed to take the load 00:45:04 it's hard to fine ones that don't. 00:45:14 the bearings should be spread apart too 00:45:49 to keep them more aligned (so to speak) ? 00:45:50 if the load is overhung by 10", that is 80 in-lbs of torque trying to bind it up 00:46:05 use a counterweight. 00:46:29 this is really hard to explain without being able to draw a picture (and dinner is now ready) 00:46:29 The Z drive motor can be mounted on the back side to counterbalance the router 00:46:38 so I'm gone for a bit 00:46:43 see ya 00:46:44 jmkasunich is now known as jmk_away 00:47:17 SWPLinux for get the motor.... lets say this was completely by hand... 00:47:32 How are you considering the X and Y axes? 00:47:54 I'd assume a frame that moves the long way, with a carriage on it that moves the short way. 00:47:55 they are flat... bearing on top of guide... 00:48:02 XY that is 00:48:03 on the carriage is the Z system 00:48:07 right 00:48:19 Then where's the torque? 00:48:25 (from overhang) 00:48:34 on the Z 00:48:52 let me back up.... 00:49:08 no - I mean, what aspect of the system makes you want to put the router 10 inches from the Y rail? 00:49:51 clearnace for say a large jewelry box 00:50:36 The router bit should always be below the rail/carriage - you shouldn't need to hang the router for that 00:51:17 If you need 12 inches of Z travel, then the rail that supports the Z carriage needs to be more than 12 inches above the bed. 00:52:03 right, but the high I raise the Z, the more excess laod there is too 00:52:07 load 00:52:25 no - there shouldn't be (except for the added weight of the support pillars) 00:52:31 I'm just trying the graps the macheancil motion consepts on how to minimize that. 00:54:33 I mean if I rasi the z to 60" and if I fubared, the 8 pound router will be binding a whole lot ! 00:54:44 look at this item http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3873284615 00:55:08 k 00:56:31 OK... bdi-4.16 is in the process of being uploaded. 00:56:49 What are the primary changes? 00:57:14 latest Synergy package. 00:57:23 OK. 00:57:58 Jymmm has quit 00:58:03 I tried deleting all of emc2 and re-checking out, also deleting src/ and updating, etc. I always end up with 1.1.6.3 for the Makefile version. 00:58:38 what incantation are you using for a checkout ? 00:59:13 cat CVS/Root 00:59:46 that should tell us what usr you used for the initial checkout. 00:59:52 :pserver:swpadnos@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/emc 01:00:44 then co -Pr bdi-4 emc2 01:01:16 for updates, cvs update -dP -C src/ 01:08:38 no idea why you should be getting an old version.... 01:09:07 me either. I may try doing an anonymous checkout, and see what happens with that. 01:09:35 Hangon.... I see the prob. 01:09:44 hanging 01:09:48 You used pserver 01:09:53 try: 01:10:15 cvs -d:ext:swpadnos@..... 01:11:14 well - I would, if my keyboard were working properly... 01:12:23 can't help with hardware errors. 01:12:40 nope - just one shell is locked up. 01:13:03 still takes anything other than normal characters (Alt, pg-up/down, etc are working, but I can't type) 01:15:20 much better - I see the changes now 01:15:45 Regarding BDI - do you know roughly how many downloads the mirrors get per month? 01:16:11 nope 01:16:46 I know Sherline were hitting nearly 1TBytes per month at one point. 01:16:46 fair enough. How about the main repository? I may be able to set up a mirror, but I don't want to go over my bandwidth allotment. 01:17:17 I imagine it goes up when there's a significant event (like post-fest, or at a new release) 01:17:23 what sort of bandwidth do you have ? 01:18:52 192GB/month 01:19:21 To be honest, I couldn't tell you anything about the download stats.... 01:19:35 I'll ask one of the mirror operators 01:19:44 192GB/mo - Is that on a 1Mbit connection ? 01:20:08 many megabits, I think. it's with http://www.dreamhost.com, the code monster (tripled) plan 01:24:09 OK - I just had a successful checkou and build. 01:24:43 there were a bunch of warnings like "*** Warning: "rt_task_delete" [/Project/EMC/emc2/src/freqmod.ko] undefined!" 01:25:00 Now all I have to do is make the USC driver work :) 01:25:08 Did you read the message printed by configure ? 01:25:23 um - no, not really 01:25:35 (youmean the flashing red one?) 01:26:39 oh - that one. Yeah - I figured the warnings were no real problem 01:28:40 the warnings about unresolved symbols is probably the one reason that puts me off committing 2.6 stuff... 01:29:07 yeah - they would be disconcerting for the average user. 01:29:39 Are they showing up because the RT "control" system is compiled separately from the low-level drivers? 01:29:50 (and linked at insmod time) 01:31:03 You know - I don't remember seeing that type of warning when compiling RTAI, and that makes modules for the testsuite. 01:31:16 maybe there's something to be learned from their make system 01:31:38 (which I noticed uses KBuild and {menu,x,qt}config) 01:33:37 jmk_away is now known as jmkasunich 01:33:44 if/when emc reaches the stage where it needs to use a GUI configuration for the build system, it is time to rethink everything. 01:34:51 Well - there is one advantage: the user could deselect any drivers they don't need, so broken drivers won't kill everyone's build. 01:35:28 (so you could just dump the old version of some driver in there, and disable it by default, and nobody with out that hardware suffers) 01:40:02 03paul_c 07bdi-4 * 10emc2/src/Makefile: Add a big warning note to the module rule - I do NOT want to be dealing with false bug reports about *** Warning 01:40:36 SWPLinux: You'll like that addition ;) 01:41:11 looks good to me :) 01:41:27 and me :o) 01:41:44 and jmkasunich ? 01:42:03 this 2 keyboard/2 mouse/3 monitor/2 computer thing can get a little much at times) 01:42:30 (one monitor with 2 switched inputs) 01:42:42 * paul_c had 5 monitors at one point.... 01:42:51 now back to three 01:42:52 * SWPLinux drools 01:43:11 all for one machine 01:43:16 Are you using a Parhelia, or multiple cards 01:43:30 fun == KVM << random button that I cannot see from where I am seated 01:43:46 three seperate cards 01:44:06 cables would not reach, so I have to bend down under desk 8- 01:44:10 and ssh int the other computers when I need to. 01:44:42 The Parhelia or P750 from Matrox (or the P650 with an upgrade) can do 3 with a single card, and things like 3D and video can be accelerated across multiple monitors. 01:45:01 (but not under Linux - the ba$tards) 01:45:21 skinflint here - Cheap ATI & Nvidia cards. 01:46:12 yeah - 3 of those are *definitely* less expensive than a Parhelia ($350 at minimum, up to $650 for the 256M version) 01:46:22 ouch 01:46:32 I have the $350 version 01:46:36 Multiple monitors would be fun - but then I'd want multiple CPU's... 01:46:49 SWP, have you had the DreamHost service long enough to have a solid impression of their service? 01:46:52 running mostly 4M matrox milleniums here ;-) 01:47:50 ah - excellent cards - I have two of those. No wait - one is a Millennium II. 01:48:18 The best image quality is just about always a Matrox. 01:48:47 I have about 6 (more dumpster pickins) 01:49:12 SteveStallings: nope - I just signed up last week. I've heard good things about them, though. 01:49:55 Who was asking (a few hours ago) about a PIC programmer? 01:50:11 Ray, referring to the human sort I think 01:50:46 Right - that's me 01:50:55 (though I prefer the Atmel AVR series) 01:51:34 rwilco has joined #emc 01:51:46 I think he was just looking for a way to implement his simple serial ideas. 01:51:57 Ah - I see. 01:52:21 SWPLinux: How were you going to tackle the USC driver ? 01:52:36 brute force and caffeiene :) 01:53:05 Basically, look at the differences between other new and old drivers to catch EMC changes 01:53:29 (build related, emc2 vs. emc1, that kind of thing) 01:53:38 Hi, I'm new, here, & didn't see any links as to what "emc" was other then the minimalist explaination of emc as "enhanced machine control" so can anybody tell me what this is? 01:54:02 then tackle the kernel related stuff ( if there is any - there may be differences with grabbing the parport addresses) 01:54:17 then actually make it work, so I can run my millingn machine :) 01:54:22 rwilco: www.linuxcnc.org 01:54:24 milling 01:55:05 neat, was looking for something like this. 01:55:21 rwilco: Basically, a software package running under linux for controling machine tools 01:56:01 I just noticed that I actually have a devide that would benefit from the serial driver we were discussing earlier. 01:56:06 device 01:56:52 It's a manual pulse generator I made. It has a serial port and a microcontroller on it. There are two LED digits, several inputs, four output bits, and an encoder knob. 01:57:19 could be useful for manual jog, a pendant, step generator, etc. 01:58:13 (that's four transistor outputs, there are other microcontroller bits that could be configured for output) 02:00:46 03paul_c * 10emc/src/emcmot/extppmcmot.c: Ran file through dos2unix to get rid of those silly line terminators. 02:08:03 well that's a pisser... knoqueror locked up 02:08:06 SWPLinux: You have one of Jon's interfaces to test ? 02:08:23 03paul_c * 10emc/src/emcmot/ (7 files): Get rid of a load of white space at the end of some of these files. 02:09:01 rwilco has left #emc 02:09:37 yep. 02:09:43 I bought the USC and GSI from Jon 02:10:34 One day I'll hook everything up to the Bridgeport, and I'll be able to use EMC!!! :) 02:21:40 just putting the finishing touches to the usc drivers 02:25:21 gonna call it a day - goodnight all 02:25:31 jmkasunich has quit 02:28:36 SWPLinux: Do you have the USC hooked up & ready for testing ? 02:29:30 not entirely, but I can hook it up pretty quickly. 02:29:56 I have a mixed-signal scope (2 analog + 16 digital channels) that I'll hook it to first. 02:29:56 start plugging in. 02:30:01 OK. 02:31:02 03paul_c 07bdi-4 * 10emc2/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Added a couple more of Jon Elson's PPMC drivers. 02:32:26 My EMC machine isn't the same as my development machine - what kernel is on BDI 4.16? 02:32:43 2.6.9-rtai 02:32:56 Adeos / RTAI? 02:33:15 yes 02:33:45 but.... You would need to install the toolchain. 02:34:13 gcc & make along with the usual dev libs. 02:34:36 I'll see what happens if I just grab a module from one and try it on the other :D 02:34:45 make sure gcc-2.95 is installed. 02:35:10 Where can I get BDI-4.16 - I have 4.12 or 4.14 on that machine now (the one with the homing bug :) ) 02:35:39 If you build on BDI-4.12 or later and use on BDI-4.16, it should work. 02:35:44 (or can I just use the emc .deb repository for the upgrade?) 02:36:17 Haven't updated the repository yet. 02:36:26 well - my devel machine is a GEntoo box, running a generic 2.6.9+Adeos kernel 02:36:53 My machine controller (a touchscreen PC) is the one with a BDI install. 02:36:53 You can compile & test on that surely ? 02:37:38 I can compile, and I may be able to test, but this is a "legacy free" motherboard - the only parallel port I can use is a PCI card I have (from www.byterunner.com) 02:38:05 (My motto is "No project too simple to make too complex" - fitting, eh? ) 02:40:33 the PCI card should work fine. 02:42:06 I'll have to install it sometime - it's not in there right now. 02:43:37 Alternatively, apt-get the tools & libs on the BDI-4.08 install and compile from source 02:44:31 Well - now the touchscreen PC doesn't want to boot - I may have an IBM DeathStar hard drive in there... It'll probably be tomorrow before I can get to too much of this. 02:45:23 well... If you are doing a fresh install, might as well try BDI-4.16 once it is up. 02:46:35 I was thinking that. Is that on the Sherline site? 02:46:56 it will be in about 10 hours. 02:47:29 OK. ("A" DSL?) 02:48:13 750K down, 128K up - Very "A". 02:48:36 yeah - I have 2M down, 256k up - similar A-ness. 02:50:33 You could compile & try loading the modules - Let me know what (if any) unresolved symbols get reported... 02:51:00 do a "make modules_install && depmod -ae" 02:51:28 OK. One sec 02:55:51 no problems through the build / install. depmod returns nothing 03:02:21 SteveStallings has quit 03:02:40 Where should I run EMC? (this is the first time I've had a successful compile on this machine) 03:03:08 I tried generic.run in the emc2 directory (the one created by the CVS checkout) 03:06:02 you did a modules_install ? 03:06:09 yes 03:07:13 ./generic.run from within the emc dir should work fine 03:07:31 OK - here are the unresolved symbols 03:07:44 shoot 03:07:52 (actually - do you want the console output, or dmesg?) 03:08:15 dmesg will be fine 03:08:30 OK - it's about 30 or so lines 03:08:47 Adeos: Domain RTAI registered. 03:08:47 RTAI[hal]: 3.1 mounted over Adeos 2.6r9c2/x86. 03:08:47 RTAI[hal]: compiled with gcc version 3.3.4 20040623 (Gentoo Linux 3.3.4-r1, ssp-3.3.2-2, pie-8.7.6). 03:08:48 RTAI[malloc]: loaded (global heap size=131072 bytes). 03:08:48 RTAI[sched_up]: loaded. 03:08:49 RTAI[sched_up]: fpu=yes, timer=periodic. 03:08:50 RTAI[sched_up]: standard tick=1000 hz, CPU freq=1800794000 hz. 03:08:52 RTAI[sched_up]: timer setup=2010 ns, resched latency=2688 ns. 03:08:53 just the last few will be enough 03:08:54 RTAI[malloc]: unloaded. 03:08:56 RTAI[sched_up]: unloaded. 03:08:58 Adeos: Domain RTAI unregistered. 03:09:00 RTAI[hal]: unmounted. 03:09:02 Adeos: Domain RTAI registered. 03:09:04 SWPLinux has quit 03:09:17 sorry - I had already pasted (43 lines) 03:09:41 SWPLinux has joined #emc 03:10:09 Do you only want the unresolved symbols? It looks like RTAI was unloaded before freqmod tried to load (could be a buffering thing) 03:10:38 just the unresolved lines. 03:10:48 freqmod: Unknown symbol nano2count 03:10:48 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_get_time 03:10:49 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_task_make_periodic 03:10:49 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_get_time_ns 03:10:50 freqmod: Unknown symbol start_rt_timer 03:10:50 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_task_delete 03:10:51 freqmod: Unknown symbol stop_rt_timer 03:10:53 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_shm_free 03:10:55 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_shm_alloc 03:10:57 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_linux_use_fpu 03:10:59 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_task_init 03:11:01 freqmod: Unknown symbol count2nano 03:11:03 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_set_periodic_mode 03:11:05 freqmod: Unknown symbol rt_task_wait_period 03:11:15 (that's all) 03:11:25 right - RTAI isn't being reloaded. 03:11:37 RTAI[malloc]: unloaded. 03:11:37 RTAI[sched_lxrt]: unloaded. 03:11:38 Adeos: Domain RTAI unregistered. 03:11:38 RTAI[hal]: unmounted. 03:12:05 those came right before the unresolved symbols 03:14:29 also, the intro graphic wasn't found. (minor point) 03:14:37 * asdfqwega does his best Freddy Mercury dance around the shop 03:15:05 Hey - you gotta be cool, relax. 03:15:27 Do you have sudo installed & configured on the gentoo box ? 03:15:43 no - I'm root, remember :) 03:15:52 I mean me. 03:16:03 still need sudo installed 03:16:13 it is installed. 03:16:29 I haven't customized its configuration 03:17:11 (though that shouldn't matter if I'm already running as root, right?) 03:17:49 if it isn't installed, bash will barf out at each invocation 03:18:40 I can send you the console output if you like - it's only 12 lines 03:19:41 paste it here 03:20:14 inivar = plat/nonrealtime/bin/inivar 03:20:14 INIFILE = generic.ini 03:20:15 RS274NGC_PARAMFILE = generic.var 03:20:15 starting emc... 03:20:16 can't find file emc.gif 03:20:18 starting EMC MOTION PROGRAM -- freqmod... 03:20:20 IO_BASE_ADDRESS 0x378 03:20:22 modprobe freqmod PERIOD=24000 IO_BASE_ADDRESS=0x378 SHMEM_KEY=100 03:20:24 FATAL: Error inserting freqmod (/lib/modules/2.6.9Adeos/extra/freqmod.ko): Unknown symbol in module, or unknown parameter (see dmesg) 03:20:27 can't install freqmod 03:20:29 generic.ini was not changed. 03:20:31 generic.var was not changed. 03:20:33 There's a 5-second pause after "Starting emc...." 03:20:43 03paul_c 07bdi-4 * 10emc2/src/emc/drivers/ppmc/ppmc_pwm.c: Fix a couple of niggling compile time warnings. 03:20:48 and about 2 seconds after "can't install freqmod" 03:21:08 (note that I have no parallel port in this machine at the moment) 03:21:22 Ah.... I bet the RTAI modules arn't in the /lib/modules path 03:22:44 what can I try to insmod to check 03:23:07 insmod rtai_sched 03:23:21 right - not found 03:24:14 copy {rtai}/modules to /lib/modules/{KVER}/rtai 03:24:18 and run depmod 03:26:25 and next time you build RTAI, use the --with-module-dir=/lib/modules/$(KVERS)/rtai with configure 03:28:11 there are a bunch of modules in {KVER}/extra 03:28:33 yup - those will be the emc modules. 03:28:43 when I ran depmod, I still couldn't load rtai_sched (from any old directory) 03:29:22